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Posts by santonacci


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Forum Topic Date Replies
The Lounge "a church is something that cannot be defined under the U.S. Constitution" Apr 24 2015
19:37 (UTC)
1

I don't know about the constitution, but the IRS has some guidelines as to how they determine if an organization is a "church" and qualifies for tax exempt status.

As to "Can anything be a church?" - I think that if someone is willing to be creative enough and put the time into writing their own material, we've already seen the answer is YES.

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 17 2015
14:02 (UTC)
3
Original Post by amwick:

Original Post by santonacci:

 

Well, my question was not really directed at you, but Borked's assertion that the death penalty can provide an incentive in getting a criminal to a place of redemption, so therefore a society which uses the death penalty still believes in redemption. 

I asked about time because saying "Sure, I believe in human redemption, but not if it's going to take too long or cost me money" implies to me that we really don't. 

Well, I did say way back that it was too slow,, but besides that any notion of redemption is meaningless (to me)  for a culture that rewards martyrdom.. Unless you are talking about green stamps, and not a human soul. 

I was discussing our culture, not theirs.

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 16 2015
21:02 (UTC)
8
Original Post by amwick:

Original Post by santonacci:

 

ETA:  Earlier in this thread there was a post indicating the problem with the death penalty is that it's too slow.  If we go by that standard, death row inmates are just SOL, right?

Well, so what?   It takes too long and it costs too much.   Compassionate people may say that it is cruel to keep someone under the death row conditions for so long.  A federal death row sentence is much, much quicker. 

 

Well, my question was not really directed at you, but Borked's assertion that the death penalty can provide an incentive in getting a criminal to a place of redemption, so therefore a society which uses the death penalty still believes in redemption. 

I asked about time because saying "Sure, I believe in human redemption, but not if it's going to take too long or cost me money" implies to me that we really don't. 

The Lounge Are you getting burned out by the state of the world? Apr 16 2015
14:50 (UTC)
10
Original Post by floggingsully:

Remember, things are actually getting better pretty much across the board.

And there is now such a thing as space donuts!

Seriously, OP, I understand the inclination - sometimes you need to seek out good news.

I hope you get a better outlook soon.

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 15 2015
18:27 (UTC)
19
Original Post by gotborked:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

i didn't say that any entity must believe anything. i said that, collectively, either we believe that human beings are capable of redemption or we don't. we don't have to believe that every individual will redeem themselves in order to believe that, as a species, we are capable of doing so.

your response, quite clearly, was what you think that you as an individual would do.

Original Post by gotborked:

I don't know. If it were me, I think the reality of my impending execution would actually be a huge motivator to seek redemption asap.

again, we're not making laws based on what gotborked, hypothetically, would do, were gotborked on death row. we're making laws based on societal values, which evolve over time but do not change with specific circumstances.

Maybe I'm misinterpreting, but you seem to be implying that a society that imposes the death penalty does not have the societal value of believing human beings on death row are capable of and/or worthy of seeking redemption. My post uses a hypothetical to illustrate the point that your implication about a society's values -- that pro-death penalty = belief that human beings are not capable of redemption -- is a faulty assumption. A society can be pro-death penalty and still believe in redemption, and a society could rationally argue that it uses the death penalty to foster redemption. Obviously not everyone on death row will seek redemption, just like every lifer won't seek it either. I cannot say which is more effective.

we're also not making laws based on what generic christians who theoretically believe that they will meet their maker hypothetically think they would do. the law is funny like that.

The idea of a "maker" is found across the world and throughout history, and is not something limited to generic north american christians, but that's not the point.

Maybe you're being obtuse, or maybe you really didn't know, but "meet your maker" is a figure of speech--the point is that knowledge of one's own imminent death (regardless of what the person believes about where they came from) typically encourages introspection, making amends, etc.

Your bolded addition is an interesting concept, Borked.

Assuming that this is really a reason why any significant percentage of people in the US support the death penalty:  How does a pro-death penalty society determine the adequate length of time to give a human being to come to redemption?

ETA:  Earlier in this thread there was a post indicating the problem with the death penalty is that it's too slow.  If we go by that standard, death row inmates are just SOL, right?

The Lounge The Dust Bowl Apr 10 2015
15:15 (UTC)
56
Original Post by nomoreexcuses:

According to this, California's population is growing, both by natural increase (births) and net migration. But what's interesting in that article is that they're saying it's not growing enough, or not enough net migration. So there is a complete disconnect in that article between the population needs of economic growth and the population demands on natural resources.

Population is only a small portion of the issue.  The biggest water user in CA is agriculture, so unless they are involved with better farming practices, water restrictions in the general public will only make a small dent in the problem, and don't even get me started about the bottled water industry.  

There are some good ideas out there, I just doubt the political will is present to go against the inevitable push back.

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 09 2015
15:47 (UTC)
68
Original Post by supergirl77:

Original Post by santonacci:

Original Post by supergirl77:

He is an adult, his own person, and must be held accountable for his actions, regardless of the influence of his brother. 

I agree. 

Why do you feel a life sentence does not accomplish this?

It may, depending on what his wishes are. If he wants to die, then life in prison it should be. If he wants to live, electrocute the bastard.

It's unlikely the feds would choose that specific method. 

And it also seems like that's a good calculus for the accused:  Whatever it is I really want, convince everybody else I want the opposite.

ETA:  Per TV's comment - it seems to me society would be better off if the judge and jury just followed the law instead of engaging in mind games with the accused.

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 09 2015
14:18 (UTC)
81
Original Post by amwick:

 

Original Post by jules817:

I don't for a second think he deserves mercy because he was influenced by his brother. Luckily it appears that the jury felt the same way. He ran his brother over with an SUV. Then he wrote the message in the boat defending his "cause". He knew exactly what he was doing that day.

Well, life in prison could be considered merciful.  It depends on your personal point of view. 

Jules pointed out his message written on the inside of the boat, which included, in part, his prayer to Allah to be made a "shahied" - a martyr.

Depending your POV, a death sentence is answering his prayer.

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 09 2015
14:02 (UTC)
88
Original Post by supergirl77:

He is an adult, his own person, and must be held accountable for his actions, regardless of the influence of his brother. 

I agree. 

Why do you feel a life sentence does not accomplish this?

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 09 2015
13:44 (UTC)
93
Original Post by amwick:

Is there really anyone that believes Joseph Dzhokhar should be, or deserves to be rehabilitated? 

e f s

Well, I certainly do, and considering we live in a country where a majority claim to follow the teachings of a faith centered around the need and possibility for redemption, it seems to me there should be a lot more.

That doesn't mean I don't think he should be punished - he most certainly should be.  But punishment and redemption are two distinctly different things.

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 09 2015
12:47 (UTC)
103
Original Post by amwick:

Original Post by santonacci:

Original Post by amwick:

We were discussing this last night: could a person that personally objected to capital punishment serve on a jury?    

 

Apparently not on this one:

The jury is already “death qualified”: That is, only those who said they were open to applying the death penalty were allowed to serve, while those who flatly opposed it were excluded.

I thought something like that must have happened.  Otherwise the process would really be pointless.

I don't think life without parole would be pointless.

*edited*

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 09 2015
12:13 (UTC)
106
Original Post by amwick:

We were discussing this last night: could a person that personally objected to capital punishment serve on a jury?    

 

Apparently not on this one:

The jury is already “death qualified”: That is, only those who said they were open to applying the death penalty were allowed to serve, while those who flatly opposed it were excluded.

The Lounge I am an a**hat Apr 08 2015
23:28 (UTC)
4
Original Post by alaskanme:

You get an a$$hat! And you get an a$$hat!! Everybody gets an a$$hat!!!

Already did this one, but it's a goody!

*classic threads fistpump*

 

A$$hat

Funk you up

A$$hat funk you up....

The Lounge Boston Marathon Bomber's Sentence Apr 08 2015
13:12 (UTC)
139

I'm against the death penalty on principle, so life in prison with no possibility of parole or transfer.  It would certainly be consistent with previous terrorism court convictions.

I certainly don't agree with the suggestion of victims determining sentencing - there are very good reasons why they do not.

ETA:  Although, upon additional research, it appears most courts do allow for "victim impact statements" which the judge and jury can consider in their deliberations. 

The Lounge religious freedom vs gay rights -- Ding! Ding! Apr 03 2015
20:54 (UTC)
4
Original Post by lysistrata:

I've kind of lost track of the point of this whole story, to be honest, because I really can't tell why a religious protection law in a state that already provides no legal protection against discriminating on the basis of sexual orientation is going to have any impact on discriminating on the basis of sexual orientation.

What Makes Indiana's Religious Freedom Law Different?

The Lounge religious freedom vs gay rights -- Ding! Ding! Apr 03 2015
19:58 (UTC)
9
Original Post by lysistrata:

The difference is between the hypothetical "if something happened I might discriminate" and actually having ever discriminated against anybody, which doesn't seem to have happened.  Thoughtcrime vs. realcrime, if you will.

Well, to be accurate, she said "we would have to say no" not "might", as if they would think about it first or the decision would really based on something else.

Legally, I understand the difference, but, really, "What's your deal, Bro - I didn't actually discriminate, I just expressed my intent to do so" is not a good defense against public backlash.

Because the response is never going to be "Oh, well, if they haven't actually done it yet, that's okay."

The Lounge religious freedom vs gay rights -- Ding! Ding! Apr 03 2015
18:32 (UTC)
29
Original Post by dnrothx:

I'm still wondering about the moral difference between refusing to serve a black person in your restaurant and refusing to serve a member of the LGBT community.

I suppose it would have to rest on the idea that LGBT people choose to be LGBT?

Yes, one of the owners said "The lifestyle is something they choose, I choose to be heterosexual. They choose to be homosexual.  Why should I be beat over the head to go along with something they choose."

Apparently the right to discriminate doesn't have to have roots in reality.

The Lounge religious freedom vs gay rights -- Ding! Ding! Apr 03 2015
18:27 (UTC)
32

The story didn't go into it, but I'm curious as to their explanation of the quite glaring contradiction between "If a gay couple came and wanted us to provide pizzas for their wedding, we would have to say no..." and "We're not discriminating against anyone..."  Um, if you will cater a straight wedding, but not another solely because of someone's assumed "lifestyle", yeah, you are. 

I'm also curious as to what other "chosen" behavioral lifestyles are a basis for refusing catering services.  As a Christian establishment, do they also screen for people who have been divorced?  What about people who have had premarital sex or (gasp) had a baby out of wedlock?  

That being said, the threats and online reaction is rather unfair. If people don't want to eat there, just don't eat there for crying out loud.

The Lounge What is the craziest law in your state? Apr 01 2015
20:32 (UTC)
1
Original Post by kevinatthebrook:

Original Post by santonacci:

You can't drink beer out of a bucket while sitting on a curb in St. Louis.  

Although the last time I was in Soulard for Mardi Gras, nobody cited me for it.  Probably too busy busting people for going 3 miles over the speed limit (not a joke).

You're white though, right?

It's ridiculous that's a legitimate question, but, yes.  There were some black people drinking the bucket beer too, and they were left alone - but then, I don't know what may have happened to them later.

The Lounge What is the craziest law in your state? Apr 01 2015
00:41 (UTC)
5

You can't drink beer out of a bucket while sitting on a curb in St. Louis.  

Although the last time I was in Soulard for Mardi Gras, nobody cited me for it.  Probably too busy busting people for going 3 miles over the speed limit (not a joke).

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